Canadian Beer Case

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NYGman
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Canadian Beer Case

Postby NYGman » Tue Dec 05, 2017 6:56 pm

Burnaby49 has been busy...

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-42173929

Canadian Gerard Comeau liked to drive to pick up beer in the neighbouring province of Quebec, where he could get a bargain on a few cases. But the New Brunswick man didn't know what he was doing was illegal.

On Saturday 6 October 2012, Comeau got into his Honda and made the roughly two-hour drive west from his New Brunswick home to Quebec.

There the retiree stopped at a convenience store, a Quebec government-run liquor store, and a supermarket.
He bought 14 cases of beer - Miller, Bud Light, Coors, Molson - two bottles of whisky and a bottle of Stingner Premixxx liqueur.
But unbeknownst to Comeau, the local Mounties had him under surveillance as he went about his chores.
They nabbed him as soon as he crossed the JC Van Horne bridge back into New Brunswick.


Well, maybe not Burnaby49, but in my head, it is him!
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Re: Canadian Beer Case

Postby bmxninja357 » Tue Dec 05, 2017 7:14 pm

but good sir if burnaby was driving with those brands of beer it would only be to go to the dump. he is a beer snob.

used to be the same here with bc wine. it just takes a special kind of arsehole cop to call you on it.

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Re: Canadian Beer Case

Postby NYGman » Tue Dec 05, 2017 8:09 pm

Perhaps he was on a mission to save Quebec from mortal peril having to drink that swill. Either way, he is a hero!
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Re: Canadian Beer Case

Postby Burnaby49 » Tue Dec 05, 2017 9:33 pm

I doubt very much that he didn't know it was illegal. Everybody in New Brunswick knows it is illegal. The bigger issue is, should it be illegal? New Brunswick has made it illegal to bring liquor into the province, it must be purchased there. The only reason is money. The province controls the cost of alcohol and they've boosted the price of beer and other alcoholic beverages into the stratosphere as a straight money grab. However the province can only maintain their extortion racket if they have thugs to enforce it, which they do. The RCMP sets up blockades at the provincial border and searches cars for booze purchased in Quebec. That's how Comeau got nabbed. He was doing what everybody there does. When he ran low he made a beer run and stocked up. I would hardly call this "a few cases"

He bought 14 cases of beer - Miller, Bud Light, Coors, Molson - two bottles of whisky and a bottle of Stingner Premixxx liqueur.


The RCMP actually has spies in the Quebec liquor outlets near the Quebec-New Brunswick border who watch for people making large purchases. They followed him to his car, got his plate, and phoned it ahead for an ambush.

But unbeknownst to Comeau, the local Mounties had him under surveillance as he went about his chores.

They nabbed him as soon as he crossed the JC Van Horne bridge back into New Brunswick.


Ninja has run into Alberta police doing the same thing;

used to be the same here with bc wine. it just takes a special kind of arsehole cop to call you on it.

But that was random and discretionary. In New Brunswick it's official government policy. The province is desperate to keep the revenue stream coming but Comeau is throwing a spanner in the works. As the article notes some other province are in the same racket. They are desperately trying to hold on to their monopoly extortion but New Brunswick leads the pack because they've raised prices the highest and a large part of the population are close to the Quebec border. I've read that there are liquor outlets just inside Quebec at the main crossings. Note that I use the word "crossings" for everyday Canadian roads between one town and another. That's how New Brunswick treats them, as a semi-sealed border.

This is a much bigger issue than a few cases of beer which is why the Supreme Court has agreed to hear it. It goes to the heart of inter-provincial commerce and the barriers that the provinces are legally allowed to set up to regulate it. As one winery owner said it's harder to sell wine within Canada than it is to export it;

Sandra Oldfield, the former chief executive of Tinhorn Creek, a British Columbia (BC) winery, says the province's winemakers have been lobbying for about a decade for an end to provincial restrictions that stop them from being able to ship their products to clients across Canada.

"We shouldn't have a harder time trying to ship it direct to a consumer in Canada than we do to any other country in the world," she says.

This is the first court case where the wineries have the chance to address those legal barriers.

Five small wineries granted permission to appear as interveners have said the barriers "pose an existential threat" to their business by closing them off from direct national distribution to clients.

Oldfield says if Comeau wins his case, it could be a boon for winemakers in the western province.

"I jokingly call him the patron saint of British Columbia wineries," she says.

Cannabis producers are also taking an interest.


I think Comeau will win. He certainly should win. Employing police as enforcers in an extortion shakedown should be prohibited.

And you're right, I wouldn't touch that swill. But I'm not getting smug and superior about it. I live in a craft beer paradise. Others elsewhere have to make do as best they can. I've been, briefly, to New Brunswick. There are no alternatives to the contents of Comeau's trunk. Although he went too far with the Bud Light.
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Re: Canadian Beer Case

Postby AndyK » Tue Dec 05, 2017 9:57 pm

Pennsylvania (a State-store Commonwealth) used to park undercover LCB agents at various New Jersey liquor stores just across the bridges from PA.

They'd radio across the river to agents who would then take various legal actions against the rum runners.

After a plethora of complaints by the NJ store owners to the powers-that-be in Trenton, the New Jersey State Police started arresting the PA agents for various violations (loitering, running the engine while parked, etc).

After a Governor-to-Governor conversation, the PA stalking ceased.
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Re: Canadian Beer Case

Postby Number Six » Tue Dec 05, 2017 11:09 pm

Vermont taxers has had this problem with residents going to New Hampshire, land of cheap beer.

The guy must be a masochist, I mean what self-respecting beer fan still drinks Miller, Coors and Bud, with all the quality alternatives like Sam Adams and the smaller companies that are quite affordable? I don't see any reason to drink alcohol unless you are enjoying it.
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Re: Canadian Beer Case

Postby Burnaby49 » Wed Dec 06, 2017 12:02 am

Number Six wrote:Vermont taxers has had this problem with residents going to New Hampshire, land of cheap beer.

The guy must be a masochist, I mean what self-respecting beer fan still drinks Miller, Coors and Bud, with all the quality alternatives like Sam Adams and the smaller companies that are quite affordable? I don't see any reason to drink alcohol unless you are enjoying it.


You can't argue with success. The biggest selling beers in the United States last year were;

1 - Bud Light
2 - Coors Light
3 - Miller Lite
4 - Budweiser
5 - Michelob Ultra
6 - Natural Light (I had to google that one. It's an Anheuser-Busch product). You can read a review of this fine beverage in my favorite publication;
http://www.drunkard.com/natty-light/
7 - Busch Light
8 - Busch
9 - Miller Highlife
10 - Keystone Light

https://vinepair.com/wine-blog/20-best-selling-american-beers/

In other words, as a general comment, Americans are no longer drinking beer. They are guzzling low-alcohol abominations. Your Sam Adams is 17th on the list. So Comeau is entirely mainstream with American beer drinking tastes since the Molson he bought is no better than the swill in the above list.

My fridge is currently occupied with Doan's Kolsch.

http://doanscraftbrewing.com/
"Yes Burnaby49, I do in fact believe all process servers are peace officers. I've good reason to believe so." Robert Menard in his May 28, 2015 video "Process Servers".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XeI-J2PhdGs

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Re: Canadian Beer Case

Postby morrand » Wed Dec 06, 2017 2:02 am

Burnaby49 wrote:You can't argue with success. The biggest selling beers in the United States last year were;

1 - Bud Light
2 - Coors Light
3 - Miller Lite
4 - Budweiser
5 - Michelob Ultra
6 - Natural Light (I had to google that one. It's an Anheuser-Busch product).


BTW, not knowing what Natty Light is, is proof positive that you never actually attended a U.S. college. But nobody actually suggested that you had, so it's not actually an interesting piece of evidence. (Natty Light is also conventionally sold in 30 packs, which probably helps the sales figures.) Anyway:

7 - Busch Light
8 - Busch
9 - Miller Highlife
10 - Keystone Light

https://vinepair.com/wine-blog/20-best-selling-american-beers/

In other words, as a general comment, Americans are no longer drinking beer. They are guzzling low-alcohol abominations.


I am always one to argue with success, and to do so, here are the empty bottles I currently have in my collection on the end of my coffee table:
  • Clown Shoes Blaecorn Unidragon
  • Stone Chai-Spiced Imperial Russian Stout
  • Howe Sound Pothole Filler Imperial Stout. This is the centerpiece of the collection, if only because it's a neat bottle. 1 litre, but with both a bottle cap and a swing top. This is an excellent encouragement not to finish the whole bottle in one sitting, which is good since it's 9% ABV. (The beer itself was fine, but also...well-named, if you get my meaning.)
  • Stone Americano Stout. Lot of stouts here.
  • Clown Shoes Undead Party Crasher
  • Arrogant Bastard Double Bastard Ale
  • Stone IPA

I won't vouch for or against any of these in particular, although the chai-spiced ale was quite odd. Some of the bottles I keep because they're cool, others because I want to know what to avoid the next time I'm out at the store.

One that's not there is New Glarus Spotted Cow, which is made by a brewery in New Glarus, Wisc., and is not sold outside of Wisconsin. This makes it much prized by some Illinoisans, who (to bring this back toward the original topic) regularly smuggle it across the state line, sometimes in prodigious quantities. As far as I know, the state police on either side haven't bothered to intervene in this traffic, though, probably because it's not a matter of tax evasion and because neither state runs their own bottle shops.
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Re: Canadian Beer Case

Postby Pottapaug1938 » Wed Dec 06, 2017 2:49 am

"The RCMP actually has spies in the Quebec liquor outlets near the Quebec-New Brunswick border who watch for people making large purchases. They followed him to his car, got his plate, and phoned it ahead for an ambush."

Massachusetts does this for people who go to New Hampshire to buy fireworks -- they may do it for booze, also. Of course, the people who get caught are the ones who, in the local parlance, immediately "bang a U-ey" and head straight back to Massachusetts. Smarter people continue on into New Hampshire, find a way to kill a few hours, and then return home on a different route, using secondary or tertiary roads if possible.

"You can't argue with success. The biggest selling beers in the United States last year were;

1 - Bud Light
2 - Coors Light
3 - Miller Lite
4 - Budweiser
5 - Michelob Ultra
6 - Natural Light
7 - Busch Light
8 - Busch
9 - Miller Highlife
10 - Keystone Light"

The only legitimate use for any of that swill is for target practice. After World War II, my late father and uncle used to get cans of spolied beer from the local packie (package store, which is New Englandese for liquor store), and take them to a sandpit where they would plink at them with .22s. Those cans made a nice sight when the bullets hit.

Fortumately, I have a son who works for one of the top craft brewers in the country; and I live in New England where I could spend my entire life roaming the region, drinking excellent brew after excellent brew (hard work, but someone has to do it).
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Re: Canadian Beer Case

Postby JamesVincent » Wed Dec 06, 2017 3:51 am

Even as an alcoholic I wouldn't have willingly touched anything on that forsaken list of fine piss waters. To show the depth of my contempt for them I'll tell you a little story from when I was still drinking heavily.

A friend and I were pulling a late nighter working on a 91 Cobra, getting it ready for a show the following day. The owner of said jalopy had promised us a case of Sam Adams and a token monetary amount for our labors. Well, low and behold, as the evening rolls on we start getting thirsty and demand the liquid part of our pay. The owner leaves and then returns with a case of Coors light. Much to our amazement he then announces that he's spending the night at his girlfriends and leaves again.

The 2 of us look at each other and start muttering. Finally I left and returned with a case of Sam Adams (for me) and few Foster's oilcans (for him). Finally we were in the proper mood for working!

As the night wore on we noticed his radiator was low on coolant. After looking around we noticed the only anti-freeze available was, you guessed it, the case of Coors light. We poured in every single can of it. Best use ever for Coors.

(We were punished by the gods for being the nice guys we were. We got tricked into working on that car more time than I care to remember, and got screwed over just as many times by that owner. It wasn't until the engine finally blew that we were free of it. At least with a blown engine we didn't have to worry about the 10 mm socket we dropped down the intake while switching manifolds.)
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Re: Canadian Beer Case

Postby Burnaby49 » Fri Dec 08, 2017 2:12 am

Canada is facing a crisis of unprecedented scope! Our entire federal/provincial system of government is facing imminent collapse if that selfish bastard Gerard Comeau wins his claimed right to cheap beer! It's ludicrous that Canada might break apart over Bud Light and Coors, it turns tragedy into farce, but that's what we're facing. Just ask the lawyer from New Brunswick valiantly trying to hold the whole collapsing system together;

The province contends that overturning the $292.50 ticket Gerard Comeau received for bringing 14 cases of beer and three bottles of liquor across the provincial boundary would mean “an end to Canadian federalism as it was originally conceived, has politically evolved and is judicially confirmed."


Sure the province is desperately trying to keep a monopolistic revenue source but they are really doing it for a more altruistic, noble reason. They've stepped up to defend the Canadian constitution itself! It's their constitutional duty to screw the people of New Brunswick!

“The province has a very legitimate interest in raising money through the sale of alcohol, and therefore the control of alcohol,” said New Brunswick Crown prosecutor Bill Richards. “So I’m not shying away from the fact that this is a money-maker, and it would be silly to do so. It is, but it’s necessary to fulfill the constitutional obligations of the province.”


They've brought in the big guns. "Bill Richards" is clearly a pseudonym. Check the syntax,

"This case began as a simple ticket offence," said the argument from the New Brunswick government. “A simple case it is not.


It's a dead giveaway who their lawyer is. May I present plaintiff's counsel?

Image

http://vancouversun.com/news/canada/fre ... ce0735c187

Notwithstanding the overwrought rhetoric there actually are very important ramifications of what seems like a trivial case. It's in this paragraph;

The court also heard a joint submission from dairy, egg, chicken and turkey farmers, the only non-government intervenors speaking against Comeau’s side. They said that allowing his victory to stand “could result in the destruction of supply management — a regulatory system in place for generations, on which the livelihood of thousands of farmers across Canada depends.”

The ramifications of the case go much further than alcohol. If the Supreme Court sides with Comeau, a swath of protectionist barriers set up by the provinces could be next to fall, affecting industries from agriculture to e-commerce. R v. Comeau is being watched closely by business groups, academics, and libertarians who have long bemoaned Canada’s provincial trade barriers. Although the provinces and federal government recently announced a “Canadian Free Trade Agreement” that reduced some of the barriers, the agreement carved out a wide array of exceptions, including for alcohol, financial services and supply management.


The supply management system is, to be blunt, a system that the USSR would have lauded and approved. A pure communistic system set up by the federal government to let a few farmers have a rent-seeking stranglehold on all of Canada's dairy, poultry, and egg production. How? By regulating the supply of these products through production quotas. Not minimum amounts produced but maximums. You Americans might find it hard to believe but the production of these absolutely basic food products is strictly controlled by the federal government to guarantee the producers a fat profit. It is illegal, criminal, to start a chicken or dairy farm without quotas and there are none. Prices aren't set by supply and demand but by cost. The government allows farmers to recoup all of their costs and adds a nice built-in profit. Nobody cares about efficiency or the consumer. Most dairy, egg and chicken farms are tiny by any rational economic sense. The only way to maintain this is by;

1 - Banning imports
2 - Restricting quotas

To step into politics for a moment one of the American government's key demands in the current NAFTA negotiations is the right to export milk and egg products to Canada. Since the FT stands for "Free Trade" this is an entirely valid issue for the United States but the Canadian government is adamant that this will not happen. We also have an exclusion for these products from our so-called free trade agreement with Europe. You'll note, amazing as it may seem, that Canada recently enacted a free trade agreement with . . . . Canada! And, a perfect Canadian touch, they exempted everything of any significance or controversy from the agreement so that it changed nothing at all.

Since there are few dairy quotas in western Canada, most seem to be in Quebec, much of the milk we get in Vancouver is trucked over 3,000 miles from Quebec. Just insanity. So of course the farmers are fighting any legislative interpretation that imperils their monopolistic position.

That's a lot of freight that Comeau's few dozen beer are pulling in order to save one retiree a $293 fine.
"Yes Burnaby49, I do in fact believe all process servers are peace officers. I've good reason to believe so." Robert Menard in his May 28, 2015 video "Process Servers".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XeI-J2PhdGs

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Re: Canadian Beer Case

Postby eric » Fri Dec 08, 2017 4:46 am

Burnaby49 wrote:The supply management system is, to be blunt, a system that the USSR would have lauded and approved. A pure communistic system set up by the federal government to let a few farmers have a rent-seeking stranglehold on all of Canada's dairy, poultry, and egg production. How? By regulating the supply of these products through production quotas. Not minimum amounts produced but maximums. You Americans might find it hard to believe but the production of these absolutely basic food products is strictly controlled by the federal government to guarantee the producers a fat profit. It is illegal, criminal, to start a chicken or dairy farm without quotas and there are none. Prices aren't set by supply and demand but by cost. The government allows farmers to recoup all of their costs and adds a nice built-in profit. Nobody cares about efficiency or the consumer. Most dairy, egg and chicken farms are tiny by any rational economic sense.

Eric puts on his pig sh*t stained ball cap, spits out his chew and explains supply management. Great idea in theory - it allows the small farmer to make what is basicly a comfortable income by following a "book" and because he is protected from competition he can theoretically produce a superior product. OK, I'm a pig farmer, no supply management in this game. We make money by producing a good enough product that we can air freight pork to Japan and Korea and make a profit. Similarly, because we are really good at swine reproduction (think pig sex) we supply roughly 300 finisher barns in the US with little Canadian piglets and if the American farmer follows our book in a barn built to our specifications they will have a reasonable profit. ...enough about pig sex. :mouthshut:

Anyways, most people don't understand the Canadian beer system. For eons beer was considered the drink of the average working class soul and was produced in a local brewery. Cheaper than a cofee for years. In the 1970's and 80's a glass of beer cost at keg rates less than a nickel and was sold at an establishment for a dime. Example - "21 up" at one establishment I used to frequent in 1978 cost 5$ which included a good tip for the waiter. 21 beer was the number of glasses that would fit on a tray. The local brewery became part of the industry for a small town offering stable long term employment. Provincial governments built up protectionist strategies to keep these multitudes of small breweries running, even though the consumer price of beer went through the roof and the breweries were bought up by large multinationals.

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Re: Canadian Beer Case

Postby Number Six » Sat Dec 09, 2017 4:10 am

As a friend pointed out the other day a lot of people drink to get **** faced to escape their miseries, not because they "enjoy" the beverages aesthetically. I've heard enough alcoholics talking about the whys and wherefores of their former drinking days to realize that the "enjoyment" may have been a mellowing of uptight, tense and formal customs they were ordinarily locked into in their role playing lives. Somehow booze helps people break out of that. There are endless examples of famous people and authors, from Noah to Faulkner and Cheever and on who were either victims of its effects or incorporated it into their writings.
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