CtC Forum 2

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Famspear
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Re: CtC Forum 2

Post by Famspear »

"Rusty", the taxpayer in the Ragan case I mentioned above, has now created a thread at losthorizons, and is elaborating on what he posted in the aforementioned other web site in a discussion with me (again, his reference to "Larry Williams" below is a reference to me):
I've filed CtC returns since 2005. Regarding 2005, I fought the IRS for two years and the Tax Court for one year. After getting into Tax Court, I took a paralegal course, and then Jurisdictionary. I have had hard-headed conversations with two lawyer friends, one of them pro-CtC (but not willing to take it to court) and the other neutral, but they both taught me the reality of how the Courts operate. My tax court experience was nearly identical to HXO's, described in the CRACKING THE COURT thread.

Here's what I learned - explained in terms that make sense to me. If the terms don't make sense to you, arguing won't help - it's the IDEA that's important, not the terminology:

I have learned, thanks to Pete, that three "branches" of Law - the Constitution, The Supreme Court, and the Statutes - very clearly do not impose a federal tax on my private-sector earnings. THOSE LAWS made me unable to sign a 1040 claiming taxes owed, unless I perjured myself.

I have learned through my experience in Court and in Class that there is a fourth branch of law that CtC does not cover. For lack of a better term, I will call this the "Law of the Courts."

The "Law of the Courts" is neither good nor bad, right nor wrong, it just simply "is." It's made up of many components - a many-headed hydra, and to prevail in court you need to deal with ALL of the heads. An example of one head is stare decisis - the Law of the Courts is made up of precedent. Stare decisis results in some good decisions, some bad decisions, but the doctrine itself is not evil, in fact it is GOOD to be able to depend that the court will act the same way that it always has. But stare decisis does not work the way you think it does. Read the following, emphasis added:

Quote:
"One of the basic tenets of analysis of case law is that, in terms of PRECEDENT, or STARE DECISIS, or the HOLDING (or holdings) in a case, a court case is important only for what was actually DECIDED -- not for what was SAID by the court in making its decision. I know that sounds strange, or even contradictory, but this is one of the little secrets of the study of law. Under the U.S. legal system, a court case is important, insofar as PRECEDENT is concerned, ONLY for the DECISION -- for the "detailed legal consequence following a detailed set of facts." See United States Internal Revenue Serv. v. Osborne (In re Osborne), 76 F.3d 306, 96-1 U.S. Tax Cas. (CCH) paragr. 50,185 (9th Cir. 1996)."
I and others like me have gone into court, pulled out our "citations," and the court has completely ignored them. Why? How can they get away with that? Corrupt Judge? Scumbag IRS Lawyer? "Silent Judicial Notice?"

None of the above. It's simply that way because of the sum total of all the "little secrets," and you don't learn these things unless you go to law school, or somebody cares enough to tell you, because the judge and your opponent are NOT going to tell you. Acting without such knowledge will get you hung. Bringing an action in court without such knowledge is, in its own way, frivolous. Is this the way it should be? I don't think so, but that doesn't matter. It's like complaining that earthquakes kill people. It simply is, and to change it is going to require dealing with it, not denying it.

Again, that's a grossly simplified version of only one of many facets. Jurisdictionary plus a paralegal class will teach you a lot, but only BEGINS to scratch the surface. Law school, and experience in court, is the only way anyone could even begin to comprehend the depth and complexity of this Law. There is a reason they call it the "practice" of Law. Good lawyers keep practicing over, and over, and over again, and still don't get it right.

I have learned that, for better or worse, the "Law of the Courts" is REAL LAW, and sadly, THAT LAW requires the private ordinary citizen to pay income tax.
http://www.losthorizons.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=1940
(bolding added).

Pete Hendrickson is not gonna like that.

Rusty continues (again, bolding added by me):
The only way to change THAT LAW is to come into court with a proper cause of action and competent facts and evidence, and get a jury to change THAT LAW, and have that change survive the inevitable appeal.

I have humbly learned that I am not ready or competent to do that.

Therefore I have decided to quit this battle. THAT LAW now enables me to sign a 1040 claiming taxes owed without perjuring myself. THAT LAW is what I am going to follow from now until THAT LAW is changed. Does that mean I'm giving up? I hope not. I've been on the front lines, but my .45 is out of ammo, and it wasn't working very well against WMD's anyway. So it's time for me to retreat and re-arm. It will take awhile. I will continue paralegal studies, might get a job as a paralegal, hope to start law school, and maybe in 10 years I'll be able to affect change to THAT LAW. If someone beats me to it, then praise God! I'll start filing CtC again, and use those acquired legal skills and the extra money to fight some other battle for Liberty. Pete has called for CtC-educated lawyers to step up. Have you seen any? So if the lawyers won't become CtC-educated, then the CtC-educated will have to become lawyers.

KNOW YOUR OPPONENT: If you want to get familiar with THAT LAW, then go to the Freedom Watch CtC Thread and start reading the comments by "Larry Williams." The quote above is from that thread. It will be very painful, but Larry knows THAT LAW very well. Larry's position is EXACTLY what you are going to encounter in the courtroom, therefore you should include Larry's knowledge in your decision-making.

Pause, and let that sink in - Larry's position is EXACTLY what you are going to encounter in the courtroom. It is wise to know your opponent. A jury will not likely help us, because the jury will be instructed by the judge in THAT LAW. Recall that even though the jury acquitted Tommy Cryer of failure to file, that SAME JURY forced him to PAY THE TAX.
Not exactly. The tax is currently being litigated in a separate case -- in U.S. Tax Court.

Rusty continues:
The only way a jury will defy the judge will be if the jury pool, i.e. the general public, believes the truth of the Fundamental Law as taught by CtC. That's going to take a lot of educating.

This decision is right for me, but everyone has to make their own decision based on their own knowledge and resources, and those that want to continue the frontline battle have all my respect and support. However, before you continue, please consider this possibility - I have concluded that mine and others' losses have already created additional precedent under THAT LAW that will be used against you. ARE YOU PREPARED? If not, you have no business in court - if you don't KNOW that you are going to win, then you will lose, just like Jurisdictionary teaches. Be Prepared. In the courtroom, truth alone is not enough.

FWIW - I believe the strategy outlined in CRACKING THE COURT is the most appropriate way to deal with THAT LAW, and hope to get in touch with Randy and John and help them in their efforts. I just need to get off the front lines - for now.
http://www.losthorizons.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=1940
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Re: CtC Forum 2

Post by Thule »

Rusty wrote: I have learned that, for better or worse, the "Law of the Courts" is REAL LAW, and sadly, THAT LAW requires the private ordinary citizen to pay income tax.
Well, his reasoning is rather flawed. But he get's the important part; believing, divining or feeling that CtC is the truth, won't so much good since no court will agree.

For a Losthead, this is Nobel-level thinking.
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Re: CtC Forum 2

Post by Imalawman »

Thule wrote:
Rusty wrote: I have learned that, for better or worse, the "Law of the Courts" is REAL LAW, and sadly, THAT LAW requires the private ordinary citizen to pay income tax.
Well, his reasoning is rather flawed. But he get's the important part; believing, divining or feeling that CtC is the truth, won't so much good since no court will agree.

For a Losthead, this is Nobel-level thinking.
Petey's not going to like this....independent thought is not welcome. Especially if its level headed independent thinking.
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Re: CtC Forum 2

Post by ASITStands »

Imalawman wrote:Petey's not going to like this....independent thought is not welcome. Especially if its level headed independent thinking.
When 'mutter' said, "Therefore I have decided to quit this battle," and made similar arguments about the relevance of case law, he was banned more-or-less immediately.
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Re: CtC Forum 2

Post by Famspear »

At losthorizons, user Kensei writes:
Larry Williams" = Famspear. His favorite potato chips are Jay's. He is the leader of the Quatloos forum/site, he is a CPA and attorney. Besides working, he is funded through questionable sources. He spends hours and hours at various sites, forums, etc. - how could a person with a regular job have time to do all that, to shoot down, well, everyone who disagrees with him? His compatriots are also very highly qualified in various skills, it is actually kind of scary as they can act outside of the IRS but provide them with info to bypass 'entrapment' type actions and they HAVE done that multiple times already. He is very smart and knowledgeable, and definitely out to see Pete and all of us fail. They monitor this forum regularly as well. I am not able to say more. They are definitely not just some angry web posters who like to simply argue with everybody else. We must all be vigilant, in conversations, postings, you name it. Tax Court seems to be set up to make you lose from the outset, to ignore valid concerns, deeming you automatically to be 'guilty' of whatever the IRS proposes.
http://www.losthorizons.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=1940

I have sent him this response by email:
Date: Friday, June 19, 2009

From: Famspear ("Larry")
lawfulman@gmail.com

To: Kensei
kensei56@gmail.com

Dear Kensei:

I noticed your post at losthorizons:
Larry Williams" = Famspear. His favorite potato chips are Jay's. He is the leader of the Quatloos forum/site, he is a CPA and attorney. Besides working, he is funded through questionable sources. He spends hours and hours at various sites, forums, etc. - how could a person with a regular job have time to do all that, to shoot down, well, everyone who disagrees with him? His compatriots are also very highly qualified in various skills, it is actually kind of scary as they can act outside of the IRS but provide them with info to bypass 'entrapment' type actions and they HAVE done that multiple times already. He is very smart and knowledgeable, and definitely out to see Pete and all of us fail. They monitor this forum regularly as well. I am not able to say more. They are definitely not just some angry web posters who like to simply argue with everybody else. We must all be vigilant, in conversations, postings, you name it. Tax Court seems to be set up to make you lose from the outset, to ignore valid concerns, deeming you automatically to be 'guilty' of whatever the IRS proposes.
I am not "the leader" of the Quatloos forum site. I was made a moderator back in March. There is a level above moderator, which is called "administrator." Having been at Quatloos only about two years, I am a relative newcomer there, compared to many of the posters.

Regarding this statement: "Besides working, he is funded through questionable sources."

Baloney.

Regarding this: "He spends hours and hours at various sites, forums, etc."

True.

Regarding this: "how could a person with a regular job have time to do all that, to shoot down, well, everyone who disagrees with him?"

Kensei, one of the advantages of being a person who has attained a certain age and a certain, shall we say, work status, is the benefit of having the time. I do have what I would call a "regular job" -- but my flexibility in my job might be greater than what you may be used to.

Kensei, you wrote:
-----"His compatriots are also very highly qualified in various skills, it is actually kind of scary[,] as they can act outside of the IRS but [can] provide them [provide IRS personnel] with info to bypass 'entrapment' type actions and they HAVE done that multiple times already."

I can't speak for anyone else at Quatloos, but I have never provided IRS personnel with any information about followers of the Cracking the Code method (except when an IRS person reads one of my posts on the internet).

And by the way, any emails you (or others) send to me in this regard are considered confidential. Yes, I'm subject to obeying the legal process of summons, subpoena, and court order like anyone else, but barring that or some other legal obligation to reveal information, I do not share what you tell me by email with anyone at Quatloos (unless you give permission). Subject to the same constraints, I also do not post, at Quatloos, information obtained from your emails.

I and other Quatloos regulars do monitor losthorizons almost daily, and we do post information from losthorizons over and Quatloos (and laugh at it, etc.). Obviously, the IRS can read losthorizons material both by visiting the site (which I suspect they do on a daily basis) and by reading comments at Quatloos (which I also assume they do).

Peter Hendrickson and his followers are engaged in a criminal enterprise (namely willfully using the Cracking the Code scheme to obtain fraudulent tax refunds or credits). I AM DEFINITELY OUT TO SEE YOU FAIL IN THAT ENTERPRISE, as you said. However, my "efforts" include nothing more than what you see on the internet, at web sites like Quatloos.

Also, that does not mean that I want the followers of Pete to end up in jail. I just want them to stop ruining their lives, and to stop breaking the law.

Tax Court is not "set up to make you lose from the outset." Your chances of winning in Tax Court on a Cracking the Code method are next to nil, but not because the system is somehow stacked against you. You lose because the Cracking the Code theory is a tax law equivalent of the argument, in astronomy, that the Moon is Made of Green Cheese.

Clue to all followers of Peter Hendrickson: For me, THIS IS A HOBBY. I make the big bucks in a REAL tax practice. This (studying tax protesters/tax deniers) is not a real tax practice, kids.

Since I cannot do so, please feel free to post this message in losthorizons. (I will probably post [t]his message somewhere at Quatloos.)

Yours,
Famspear ("Larry")
EDIT: Kensei's contention -- that Quatloos regulars have provided IRS personnel with information to bypass entrapment type actions on multiple occasions -- is interesting. I'm not sure what specific cases he is talking about (or, alternatively, just blowing smoke about, as the case may be).

EDIT 2: At losthorizons, Kensei has since edited his above-referenced post several times.
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Re: CtC Forum 2

Post by Imalawman »

um..well, considering some of us used to be or still are working for the ebil gubmint, yes, we've "provided information" to our agencies through ourselves. And yes, private sector workers have pointed out some things from time to time to the government. However, its not a grand conspiracy - it is very rare and only for rather egregious scenarios.
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Re: CtC Forum 2

Post by Famspear »

Kensei wrote:
We [users of Hendrickson' Cracking the Code method] must all be vigilant, in conversations, postings, you name it.
(bolding added).

In some cases, it may be too late for that now, Kensei.
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Re: CtC Forum 2

Post by Pottapaug1938 »

Imalawman wrote:um..well, considering some of us used to be or still are working for the ebil gubmint, yes, we've "provided information" to our agencies through ourselves. And yes, private sector workers have pointed out some things from time to time to the government. However, its not a grand conspiracy - it is very rare and only for rather egregious scenarios.
You know that; I know that; and most Quatloosers know that. As for the Loserheads, they don't want to let the facts get in the way of their delusions and paranoia. Kensei is the perfect example.
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Re: CtC Forum 2

Post by Famspear »

In the same thread, "Submarine Veteran" writes:
What "Larry" is telling you is this:

You are insignificant and walking into a den of thieves and have no chance of winning. We have the power as we have the guns and we are certainly not going to hesitate to use them, unlike the average good American who wouldn't think of it. He is likely correct.
No, SubVet, what I am saying is that you have no chance of winning -- because (1) the Cracking the Code scam is based on the doofus theory that your regular private sector earnings not connected with an activity involving a federal privilege are thereby not taxable, and (2) this doofus theory is a legal equivalent of arguing, in the study of astronomy, that the Moon Is Made of Green Cheese.

The government certainly has the power and certainly has the guns. That's beside the point. You, SubVet, and your fellow scammers will lose not because the government has the power and the guns, but because you are wrong about what the law is.
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Re: CtC Forum 2

Post by webhick »

Famspear wrote:this doofus theory is a legal equivalent of arguing, in the study of astronomy, that the Moon Is Made of Green Cheese.
Yeah, 'cause everyone knows that Moonbats are lactose intolerant.
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Re: CtC Forum 2

Post by Imalawman »

webhick wrote:
Famspear wrote:this doofus theory is a legal equivalent of arguing, in the study of astronomy, that the Moon Is Made of Green Cheese.
Yeah, 'cause everyone knows that Moonbats are lactose intolerant.
Really? Well, that explains a LOT.
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Re: CtC Forum 2

Post by Gregg »

Kensei's contention -- that Quatloos regulars have provided IRS personnel with information to bypass entrapment type actions on multiple occasions -- is interesting. I'm not sure what specific cases he is talking about (or, alternatively, just blowing smoke about, as the case may be).
Well, he has a point, remember when we made a list of all the people who had gotten illegal refunds and posted not only their names, but copies of the checks and....

oh, wait a minute.
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Re: CtC Forum 2

Post by . »

Delusional Crackhead wrote:Tax Court seems to be set up to make you lose from the outset, to ignore valid concerns, deeming you automatically to be 'guilty' of whatever the IRS proposes.
Just to drive our paranoid little Crackhead friend out of his skull, here are 15 REAL taxpayer victories (unlike temporary, fraudulent Crackhead refunds which are later recovered) in U.S. Tax Court that I found in about 10 minutes of looking, many of them for very significant amounts of money, many including fairly nasty slap-downs of the IRS's position and at least one including an award of attorney fees to the petitioner:

Maddox v. Commissioner of Internal Revenue, T.C. Memo. 1998-449
http://www.ustaxcourt.gov/InOpHistoric/ ... CM.WPD.pdf

Stolte v. Commissioner of Internal Revenue, T.C. Memo. 1999-271
http://www.ustaxcourt.gov/InOpHistoric/ ... CM.WPD.pdf

Estate of Lassiter v. Commissioner of Internal Revenue, T.C. Memo. 2000-324
http://www.ustaxcourt.gov/InOpHistoric/ ... CM.WPD.pdf

International Capital Holding v. Commissioner of Internal Revenue, T.C. Memo. 2002-109
http://www.ustaxcourt.gov/InOpHistoric/ ... CM.WPD.pdf

Estate of Stone v. Commissioner of Internal Revenue, T.C. Memo. 2003-309
http://www.ustaxcourt.gov/InOpHistoric/ ... CM.WPD.pdf

Dover Corporation v. Commissioner of Internal Revenue, 122 T.C. No. 19 (2004)
http://www.ustaxcourt.gov/InOpHistoric/ ... TC.WPD.pdf

Beiner v. Commissioner of Internal Revenue, T.C. Memo. 2004-219
http://www.ustaxcourt.gov/InOpHistoric/ ... CM.WPD.pdf

Xilinx v. Commissioner of Internal Revenue, 124 T.C. No. 4 (2005)
http://www.ustaxcourt.gov/InOpHistoric/ ... TC.WPD.pdf

Kohler v. Commissioner of Internal Revenue, T.C. Memo. 2006-152
http://www.ustaxcourt.gov/InOpHistoric/ ... CM.WPD.pdf

Myers v. Commissioner of Internal Revenue, T.C. Summ. Op. 2007-194
http://www.ustaxcourt.gov/InOpHistoric/ ... UM.WPD.pdf

Countryside Limited Partnership v. Commissioner of Internal Revenue, T.C. Memo. 2008-3
http://www.ustaxcourt.gov/InOpHistoric/ ... CM.WPD.pdf

Estate of Mirowski v. Commissioner of Internal Revenue, T.C. Memo. 2008-74
http://www.ustaxcourt.gov/InOpHistoric/ ... CM.WPD.pdf

Katz v. Commissioner of Internal Revenue, T.C. Memo. 2008-269
http://www.ustaxcourt.gov/InOpHistoric/ ... CM.WPD.pdf

Union Carbide v. Commissioner of Internal Revenue, T.C. Memo. 2009-50
http://www.ustaxcourt.gov/InOpHistoric/UCC.TCM.WPD.pdf

Judge v. Commissioner of Internal Revenue, T.C. Memo. 2009-135
http://www.ustaxcourt.gov/InOpHistoric/ ... CM.WPD.pdf
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Re: CtC Forum 2

Post by ASITStands »

Famspear wrote:I have sent him this response by email:
Date: Friday, June 19, 2009

From: Famspear ("Larry")
lawfulman@gmail.com

To: Kensei
kensei56@gmail.com
And by the way, any emails you (or others) send to me in this regard are considered confidential. Yes, I'm subject to obeying the legal process of summons, subpoena, and court order like anyone else, but barring that or some other legal obligation to reveal information, I do not share what you tell me by email with anyone at Quatloos (unless you give permission). Subject to the same constraints, I also do not post, at Quatloos, information obtained from your emails.
In light of your statement, should something be "unshared" in the above post?
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Re: CtC Forum 2

Post by Famspear »

ASITStands wrote:
Famspear wrote:I have sent him this response by email:
Date: Friday, June 19, 2009

From: Famspear ("Larry")
lawfulman@gmail.com

To: Kensei
kensei56@gmail.com
And by the way, any emails you (or others) send to me in this regard are considered confidential. Yes, I'm subject to obeying the legal process of summons, subpoena, and court order like anyone else, but barring that or some other legal obligation to reveal information, I do not share what you tell me by email with anyone at Quatloos (unless you give permission). Subject to the same constraints, I also do not post, at Quatloos, information obtained from your emails.
In light of your statement, should something be "unshared" in the above post?
If you're talking about Kensei's email address, the answer is no. That has long been public information. (He posted it at losthorizons, and that's where I found it.)
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Re: CtC Forum 2

Post by ASITStands »

Famspear wrote:If you're talking about Kensei's email address, the answer is no. That has long been public information. (He posted it at losthorizons, and that's where I found it.)
Didn't remember that. Ok. I'll go back to writing my appellate brief now.