Advantage Conferences - Tim Darnell - Jack Weinzierl

"Buy 1 for yourself and get the chance to sell your friends and family 5 and get your downline started!" We examine the multi-level marketing industry, where only the people who come up with the ideas make any money, and everybody else is left unhappy, broke, and tired of reading scripts and selling overpriced vitamins and similarly worthless products. Includes Global Prosperity, Pinnacle Quest International, IRS Codebusters, Stratia, and other new Global Prosperity scams.

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soapboxmom
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Postby soapboxmom » Sun Dec 09, 2007 5:15 pm

Direct Selling Association

Pyramid Schemes
Don't make a costly mistake!

Thousands of Americans have lost millions of dollars participating in pyramid schemes. Many of the victims knew they were gambling (although they didn't know the odds were rigged against them). Many others, however, thought they were paying for help in starting a small business of their own. These people were fooled by pyramid schemes disguised to look like legitimate businesses.

The purpose of this article is to help you avoid falling victim to pyramid schemes, whether simple or disguised. Simple pyramid schemes are similar to chain letters, while disguised pyramids are like wolves in sheep's clothing, hiding their true nature in order to fool potential investors and evade law enforcers.

CONSUMER ALERT
Avoid dealing with salespeople who:

Disparage other products or firms.
Confuse you, abuse your trust, or exploit your lack of experience or knowledge.
Try to make you cancel a contract made with another salesperson.
Falsely tell you they're taking a survey or you've just won a contest.

Avoid dealing with companies that:

Charge a substantial entry fee (more than the cost of a sales kit).
Pressure you to purchase large quantities of products.
Sell few or no products to consumers.

What is a pyramid scheme?
Pyramid schemes are illegal scams in which large numbers of people at the bottom of the pyramid pay money to a few people at the top. Each new participant pays for the chance to advance to the top and profit from payments of others who might join later. For example, to join, you might have to pay anywhere from a small investment to thousands of dollars. In this example, $1,000 buys a position in one of the boxes on the bottom level. $500 of your money goes to the person in the box directly above you, and the other $500 goes to the person at the top of the pyramid, the promoter. If all the boxes on the chart fill up with participants, the promoter will collect $16,000, and you and the others on the bottom level will each be $1,000 poorer. When the promoter has been paid off, his box is removed and the second level becomes the top or payoff level. Only then do the two people on the second level begin to profit. To pay off these two, 32 empty boxes are added at the bottom, and the search for new participants continues.

Each time a level rises to the top, a new level must be added to the bottom, each one twice as large as the one before. If enough new participants join, you and the other 15 players in your level may make it to the top. However, in order for you to collect your payoffs, 512 people would have to be recruited, half of them losing $1,000 each.

Of course, the pyramid may collapse long before you reach the top. In order for everyone in a pyramid scheme to profit, there would have to be a never-ending supply of new participants.

In reality, however, the supply of participants is limited, and each new level of participants has less chance of recruiting others and a greater chance of losing money.


Things you should know about pyramid schemes

They are losers. Pyramiding is based on simple mathematics: many losers pay a few winners.
They are fraudulent. Participants in a pyramid scheme are, consciously or unconsciously, deceiving those they recruit. Few would pay to join if the diminishing odds were explained to them.
They are illegal. There is a real risk that a pyramid operation will be closed down by law enforcement officials and the participants subject to fines and possible arrest.

Why would anyone pay to join a pyramid scheme?
Pyramid promoters are masters of group psychology. At recruiting meetings they create a frenzied, enthusiastic atmosphere where group pressure and promises of easy money play upon people's greed and fear of missing a good deal. Thoughtful consideration and questioning are discouraged. It is difficult to resist this kind of appeal unless you recognize that the scheme is rigged against you.

Disguised pyramid - wolf in sheep's clothingSome pyramid promoters try to make their schemes look like multilevel marketing methods. Multilevel marketing is a lawful and legitimate business method which uses a network of independent distributors to sell consumer products.

To look like a multilevel marketing company, a pyramid scheme takes on a line of products and claims to be in the business of selling them to consumers. However, little or no effort is made to actually market the products. Instead, money is made in typical pyramid fashion, from recruiting. New distributors are pushed to purchase large and costly amounts of inventory when they sign up.

For example, you might have to purchase $1,000 of nearly worthless products in order to become a "distributor." The person who recruited you receives $500 (a fifty percent commission) and $500 goes to the top (the company, in this case). Notice the similarity to the simple pyramid scheme described earlier.

Most disguised pyramids, however, are not this easy to unmask. Pyramid schemes often choose products which are cheap to produce but which have no established market value...This makes it difficult to tell whether there is a real consumer market for the products. The best way to avoid a disguised pyramid fraud is to know what to look for in a legitimate income opportunity...


How to tell the difference between a legitimate business and a disguised pyramid scheme

Pyramid schemes seek to make money from you (and quickly). Multilevel marketing companies seek to make money with you as you build your business (and theirs) selling consumer products. Before you sign up with a company, investigate carefully. A good way to begin is to ask yourself these three questions:

How much are you required to pay to become a distributor?
If the startup cost is substantial, be careful! The start-up fee in multilevel companies is generally small (usually for a sales kit sold at or below company cost). These companies want to make it easy and inexpensive for you to start selling. Pyramid schemes, on the other hand, make nearly all of their profit on signing up new recruits. Therefore, the cost to become a distributor is usually high. CAUTION: PYRAMIDS OFTEN DISGUISE ENTRY FEES AS PART OF THE PRICE CHARGED FOR REQUIRED PURCHASES OF TRAINING, COMPUTER SERVICES, PRODUCT INVENTORY, etc. These purchases may not even be expensive or "required," but there will be considerable pressure to "take full advantage of the opportunity." ....

Are the company's products sold to consumers?
IF THE ANSWER IS NO (OR NOT MANY), STAY AWAY! This is a key element.
Multilevel marketing (like other methods of retailing) depends on selling to consumers and establishing a market. This requires quality products, competitively priced. Pyramid schemes, on the other hand, are not concerned with sales to end users of the product. Profits are made on volume sales to new recruits, who buy the products, not because they are useful or attractively priced, but because they must buy them to participate. Inventory purchases should never be more than you can realistically expect to sell or use yourself.

Warning Signs of Fraud


Pressure to sign a contract quickly and agree to pay a large sum of money before sales claims can be investigated or legal advice obtained.
Promises of extraordinarily high or guaranteed profits
Claims that profits can be achieved easily
A required initial fee which greatly exceeds the fair market value of any products, kits or training
A large fee payable before you receive anything in return
Evasive answers by the salesperson or unwillingness to give disclosure documents required by law.


These are only warning signs of the most obvious frauds. An independent investigation is necessary in any case. A fraudulent salesperson may be prepared with glib assurances and authentic-looking documents. Remember, if it's worth your money, it's worth your time to investigate.

How to protect yourself from a bad investment

Take your time. Don't let anyone rush you. A good opportunity to build a business in a multilevel structure will not disappear overnight. People who say "get in on the ground floor" are implying that people joining later will be left out in the cold. BEWARE!

Ask questions:
About the company and its officers.
About the products - their cost, fair market value, source of supply, and potential market in your area.
About the start up fee (including required purchases).
About the company's guaranteed buy-back of required purchases.
About the average earnings of active distributors.
Get written copies of all available company literature.
Consult with others who have had experience with the company and its products.
Check to see if the products are actually being sold to consumers.
Investigate and verify all information. Do not assume that official looking documents are either accurate or complete.

Where to go for help
In addition to checking with the Direct Selling Association, you may also be able to try the following resources:

Your local Chamber of Commerce
Better Business Bureau
Public Library
Nearby university or testing laboratory
Local businesses dealing with similar products
Local city District Attorney's Office, Consumer Fraud Division
State Attorney General's Consumer Fraud Division
Federal Trade Commission
National Fraud Information Center
Local Prosecutor's Office

If you suspect that a company may be an illegal pyramid, contact your state and local law enforcement offices and the Federal Trade Commission.

This information was originally published by the Direct Selling Education Foundation, a Washington, D.C. not-for-profit public education organization. It is tax-exempt and contributions to it are tax-deductible. The objective of the Foundation is to serve the public interest with education, information and research, thereby encouraging greater public awareness and acceptance of direct selling in the marketplace.

The Foundation funds consumer and academic conferences; supports speakers, teaching materials and the writing of case studies for university marketing professors; and develops and distributes consumer information literature and audiovisual materials.

This information was originally published in cooperation the National District Attorneys Association's Economic Crime Project. It has been prepared in cooperation with the Federal Trade Commission, Washington, D.C. 20580.

© 1997 Direct Selling Education Foundation, quotes and reprints permitted with attribution.

© 1996-2007 Direct Selling Association
1667 K Street, NW, Suite 1100 Washington DC 20006-1660
Phone: 202.452.8866 | Fax: 202.452.9010

-----------------------------------------------------------

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soapboxmom
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Postby soapboxmom » Sun Dec 09, 2007 11:21 pm


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soapboxmom
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Postby soapboxmom » Mon Dec 10, 2007 1:10 am

http://www.christian-network-marketing. ... thing.html

Out-Faithing
Friday, December 7, 2007 at 12:13PM
This is a powerful message from one of the mentors in my life. It applies to whatever business you are building. Have a blessed weekend.

“Out-Faithing”

Powerful Mental Health for Business & Life

Genesis 1:3

Job 13:15

Tim Darnell

©2007 All Rights Reserved

Each person’s mental health is so crucial to success in business. At Advantage Conferences, excellent mental health is indeed part of the improved Mindset that we refer to so often. Marginal or Poor mental health always results in non-success. The degree of mental health a person has and the level of success they can attain go hand in hand. Excellent mental health opens the door to success and allows the Champion to excel in the game in the long run.

“To the naysayers, the quitters, the ignorant, the fault-finders, the scoffers, the mockers, the non-believers, et al, I simply say, ‘I will Out-Faith you, Out-Believe you, Out-Work you, and Out-last you and the certain Out-come will be beyond Out-standing – nothing short of Out-rageous Victory – Tim Darnell

What factors contribute to excellent mental health?

I. Action – We must be “in” action versus being in inaction. Action is comprised of two aspects:

A. Doing – what is the “doing” of business

1. Meeting People

2. Communicating with People

3. Serving People

4. Offering free value

5. Winning them over naturally in terms of accepting your service – purchased (monetized) value

6. Giving them a greater, Godly vision for their lives

7. Making the sale

8. Follow Up

9. Making a Difference in Others’ Lives

B. Creating – Creation is God’s ultimate work. He said, “Let there be Light” and there was. We come closer to being Godly by joining in His creative work. We are most alive when we are creating. We are most noticed when we are creating. We are most appreciated when we are creating. We are most followed when we are creating. We are most profitable when we are creating and implementing.

C. Game Planning – Clear, Illuminated Mental Image – without a game plan, you have no business. Your attitude will be one of complaining versus one of enthusiasm and hope.

· Short Term Marketing Initiative

· Long-Term Marketing Initiative

· Innovative Ideas (AMM Call a must)

· Fresh – refreshing to you, not the same old game plan

· Service Oriented – the best interest of others

· Coincide/Congruent with your financial goals and ethics

1. Revenue Stream – clear Mental Image. Specifically identifying / knowing the revenue steam you desire to develop is crucial. You can’t get to where you’re going without knowing “where you’re going” is. You can’t hit a non-disclosed target.

a. Digits / Zeroes – write that out right now. This is where you’re going to start living mentally and physically. If you want to start transacting in the $20,000.00 realm each month, you must commit to that happening. If you want to be in the $50,000.00 realm each month, then simply commit to that happening and adjust your other thinking and activities to match this thought. Six digits? The same thing. Open your mind to that money going out and that money coming in – picture it vividly and accept it, not as some mysterious declaration, but as a simple concept that will evolve into reality.

My Monthly Reality in 2008 will be:

____ Digits / ____ Zeroes

b. Avoid the Digit Pit elicited by Mistaken Thoughts: – Your NEW Revenue Stream must be vividly imagined and fully believed in, thought of, and enunciated congruently. You cannot make the move into New Digits, New Zeroes until your thinking coincides fully with where you want to be. Here’s the Teeny Mind person says right before they fall in the Digit Pit

i. “I sure hope I can pay my bills.” Where does that take your mind and your vision? It puts your mind into the “getting by” category. Scarcity is king. Scared City is the town Teeny Minds live in. You can’t hold two incongruent thoughts at the same time. You must adopt a single thought and begin living in that world.

(Game Planning, cont.)

ii. “I’m broke, how am I going to get by?”

iii. “That’s it, I can’t afford anymore.”

iv. “We couldn’t do that.”

2. Exciting Marketing Initiative / Strategy – poor mental health business people (Teeny Minds) don’t have a plan. Memories of past attempts exist in their memory – memories of plans that didn’t turn out like they thought they would. Did you know that every business, business-person, and millionaire has had hundreds of plans that they paid for and spent weeks, months and years on that didn’t work. We have witness to that fact at every single MMC.

Champion Mental Health has the next plan in the works, well-thought-out, and being sculpted to as close to perfect as time allows. Amateurs dwell on some past initiative that didn’t bring results. Champions don’t give past initiatives or expenditures a second thought other than to learn from them

3. Removing the Obstacles – This is an ongoing, never-ending process. You must constantly survey and inspect your business, financial situation and Mindset in order to ferret out the resistance point, the Giants, and walls. What are the things holding me back? Ask others – what do you see in me that is holding me back and humbly listen to their answers.

a. Unbelief

b. Lack of Capital Resourcefulness – refusal to use debt, personal savings, credit cards, loans, outside investors, etc.

c. Fear of Talking to People

d. Fear of Success

e. Fear of Being the Leader / Champion

f. Lack of Delegation

D. OUT-FAITHING MEDIOCRITY AND DEFEAT - Sustained Unwavering Belief – THE FAITH FACTOR – Job 13:15 “Though He slay me, I will hope in Him.” Unconquerable Faith. Unquenchable Spirit. Undeniable Presence. These lead to Unprecedented Accomplishment.

Posted by Jack Weinzierl in The Christian Entrepreneur | Comments Off

cdj1122

Postby cdj1122 » Mon Dec 10, 2007 9:45 pm

.
Fifty years ago I came across my first marketing scheme and even though I was young then it sounded like a scam to me then. I do not even think I knew the word "scam" at the time.
.
It just seemed to violate two rules of living that I had absorbed in High school and college.
.
"You cannot cheat an honest man"
and
"If something sounds too good to be true, it most likely is."

To which I later added
" If someone dresses some scheme up in religion, no matter how fancy a hat the story wears, it is probably worthless."
.

Three rules that have served me well for a long time.
.
It took me two days to wade through the posts in this thread and many of the links that were attached and I began to laugh about half way through.
.
How people can be so stupid and listen to this charactor, giving him their money is beyond me.
.
I recently read a report somewhere that seemed to imply that some people have a genetic tendency to believe religius tales, scam artists and urbal legends equally.
.
And yet it is sdad that people fall for this stuff.

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soapboxmom
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Postby soapboxmom » Tue Dec 11, 2007 11:17 pm

WikiHow had an Advantage Conferences ad placed by Texas Attorney2000, Duane Kidman. I made a post in favor of deletion of what was clearly an ad and not a how to article.

That is clearly an ad for a business with a confirmed 98% loss rate from the suit Darnell, President of Advantage Conferences, filed against the Better Business Bureau of Dallas. The BBB won with a superb Summary Judgment Motion and got a Writ of Garnishment to get paid as Scammer Tim refused.

Advantage has many folks out $20,000 or more for conferences and fruitless advertising. Hundreds will never receive the magazine subscritions they paid for after the one issue wonder bombed. Many other reps are out thousands in commissions they never received for life insurance on seniors Advantage was selling that of course had no polices get written. Stranger owned life insurance like they tried to push is sickening at best and it thankful the policies didn't go through. The reps who got licensed to sell it and lost thousands are very angry, however.

That Texas attorney pushing this garbage should be disbarred.


Duane Kidman answered me as follows:
Reply to 71.164.236.55 (Soapboxmom)
On 18:42, 26 November 2007
Texas_attorney2000 said:

The details concerning the case: Advantage Conferences LLC vs. Better Business Bureau of Metropolitan Dallas, Inc., et al., Case No.05-11461 in the Judicial District Court of Dallas County, Texas is not clearly stated by 71.164.236.55's commentary.

There was a Motion for Summary Judgment, filed by Advantage Conferences, but was denied. The case was ultimately dismissed before trial.

There was not any decisive winner, nor was there any ruling that Advantage Conferences is a scam or that Tim Darnell is a scammer. These appear to be conclusions not found by a court of law, rather a conclusion of an angry individual; pity.

Although unconfirmed: the claims, accusations, and inaccurate statements of the preceding commentary mirror those made by *****(aka Soapboxmom), a known Advantage Conference antagonist. Ms. Scambuster is known to have rallied a small number of followers to proliferate her personal conquest against Advantage Conferences.

If materials of wikiHow are to be edited for accuracy, this should include commentaries and personal attacks.


I answered Duane with:
Reply to Texas_attorney2000
On 22:27, 11 December 2007
71.164.236.55 said:

Texas Attorney,

I have the court papers in my hand. Why don't you actually read the source documents and quit listening to Timmy boy. Judge Mary Murphy granted the Motion for Summary Judgement and I have confirmed that Tim was forced to pay by a Writ of Garnishment. The BBB's attorneys at Jackson Walker will be able to confirm that for you. You should also be aware that former reps are pursuing all legal avenues available to them and I will do everything I can to help them.

I am simply out to protect the public and I would hardly call sharing the truth attacks. Folks need to know the facts before they lose thousands to this venture. Tell Timmy lying about BBB membership, trademarks, copyrights, service marks, refunds and earnings etc. is not how honest folks do business.

Tim is claiming I have stalked him day and night at his home and recreational events and that I am sending him death threats. Yet, he says he has no idea what I look like. I went to the Allen, TX police and asked them to investigate me. Why is it Tim hasn't reported any of this to the authorities? They can't confirm delusions!

It is truly sad to see that an attorney in Texas would push this kind of venture. Duane Kidman, may I suggest you get the facts.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

CAUSE NO. 05-11461 ADVANTAGE CONFERENCES, LLC, PLAINTIFF, IN THE DISTRICT COURT vs. § § § § § § § § § § § 14TH JUDICIAL DISTRICT BETTER BUSINESS BUREAU OF METROPOLITAN DALLAS, INC. AND JON TAYLOR, DEFENDANTS. DALLAS COUN1Y, TEXAS ORDER GRANTING SUMMARY JUDGMENT On this 25th day of September, 2006, came on for hearing Defendant Better Business Bureau of Metropolitan Dallas, Inc.'s Motion for Summary Judgment ("Motion") filed on August 21, 2006. The Court, having reviewed the Motion, Plaintiffs Response to the Motion, Defendant's Reply, and all timely filed pleadings, and all competent, timely filed summary judgment evidence, and having heard the arguments of counsel, is of the opinion that the Motion should be GRANTED in all respects.

IT IS THEREFORE ORDERED, ADJUDGED AND DECREED that Defendant Better Business Bureau of Metropolitan Dallas, Inc.'s Motion for Summary Judgment filed on August 21, 2006 is hereby GRANTED in all respects. IT IS FURTHER ORDERED, ADJUDGED AND DECREED that Plaintiff Advantage Conferences, LLC take nothing from Defendant Better Business Bureau of Metropolitan Dallas, Inc. by reason of its action and that Defendant Better Business Bureau of Metropolitan Dallas, Inc. recover from Plaintiff its costs of court, for which let execution issue.

All relief as between Advantage Conferences, LLC and Better Business Bureau of Metropolitan Dallas, Inc. not expressly granted herein is denied. Signed this 2; day of October, 2006. Judge~ Mary Murphy


ORDER GRANTING SUMMARY JUDGMENT - PAGE 1


Perhaps someone here could take the legalese and put it into legalese that attorney Duane Kidman could understand. Timmy Darnell is still running around telling everyone that he didn't lose the case he filed against the BBB. Would one of the attorneys here be kind enough to explain the final dispostition of the case for all those who have only heard Timmy's version and have not read any of the source documents. Obviously I am not explaining it to their satisfaction.

Soapboxmom

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wserra
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Postby wserra » Thu Dec 13, 2007 11:19 am

SBM - Kidman's wife is an Advantage Conferences rep. Wife or no, a lawyer should be really careful with the commercials on his website. Someone ripped off by an obvious scam might well have a complaint against the lawyer who advertises it.

SBM wrote:Perhaps someone here could take the legalese and put it into legalese that attorney Duane Kidman could understand.


" :idea: $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ :idea: "

There you go. Glad to be of service.
"A wise man proportions belief to the evidence."
- David Hume

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soapboxmom
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Postby soapboxmom » Thu Dec 13, 2007 1:59 pm

wserra,

Thank you for the reply. We might still need to review that minor detail of who won the case. Let's look again at what dear Duane wrote:

There was a Motion for Summary Judgment, filed by Advantage Conferences, but was denied. The case was ultimately dismissed before trial.

There was not any decisive winner


summary judgment
A final decision by a judge that resolves a lawsuit in favor of one of the parties. A motion for summary judgment is made after discovery is completed but before the case goes to trial. The party making the motion marshals all the evidence in its favor, compares it to the other side's evidence, and argues that a reasonable jury looking at the same evidence could only decide the case one way--for the moving party. If the judge agrees, then a trial would be unnecessary and the judge enters judgment for the moving party.


Again, a very minor point, no doubt, but didn't Timmy lose? Perhaps we could review the final disposition again for those who aren't clear.

The Order Granting Summary Judgment, which can be enjoyed in its entirety in my previous post, and that lovely Writ of Garnishment gave me the distinct impression that the BBB had a decisive victory!

Soapboxmom

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Postby soapboxmom » Sat Dec 22, 2007 2:52 pm

------ Forwarded Message
From: Tim Darnell <tim_darnell>
Date: Sun, 24 Sep 2006
Subject: TGIM Call - You are Capable...

Beloved Team,

Tomorrow morning I am in the courtroom again, this obligation requiring me to miss the TGIM Team Call in the morning.

I leave you with this message to replace my absence in the morning, entitled “You are Capable”.


You are capable of effective and memorable leadership.
You are capable of greatness, beyond your wildest imagination.
You are capable of Slaying Your Giant, once and for all.
You are capable of totally transforming your financial situation in multiplicative terms.

You are capable of influencing others in ways that elevate and amplify the prospects for their future.
You are capable of being a respected, recognized voice for truth.

You are capable of leading others, many others, to salvation in Jesus Christ.
You are capable of playing a very important role in the solution of many of the world’s needs
You are capable of being God’s hands, feet, and voice in a world that often ignores God’s presence.


My friend, the bottom line is: You are Capable.

My apologies – I am disappointed in not being able to share our normal time in the AM. I am with you in spirit, and I ask your prayers for the expedient and definitive positive resolution of the battle against our adversaries. Make no mistake, when you work and breathe for God, the outcome is assured. Our victory is a foregone conclusion, and we enter the rest of the battle with enthusiasm and sustained, unwavering belief.

Thank you for entering the battle with me. It’s the only place to be.

Blessings,


Tim Darnell
President
Advantage Conferences
Office: 972-727-4995
1-888-832-7635


Gee, Timmy are you sure about all that? I wonder if history will repeat itself?

Soapboxmom

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Postby soapboxmom » Thu Dec 27, 2007 1:16 am

http://www.pyramidschemealert.org/PSAMain/news/AmwaySuedasPyramidScheme.html

Using Quixtar's own payout data a report published by Pyramid Scheme Alert has shown that 99% of all Quixtar recruits never earn any profit. In the report, "The Myth of MLM Income Opportunity," the 99% loss rate was shown to be caused by the pyramid recruitment model and the lack of retail sales, not the "failure" of the recruits.

Regarding the charge that the "non-retailing" business plan that most Quixtar recruits engage in is a scam, the FTC has prosecuted other MLMs on these grounds. FTC declarations have stated that if the majority of the money used to pay the "upliners" is gained primarily from the purchases of the downliners – not from their retail customers – the payments are de facto payments for recruiting. In such cases, the "business opportunity" is not to sell the MLM products but to recruit others into the "business opportunity" in an endless chain. Endless chains are considered "inherent frauds" since they cannot deliver on their promise of income to any but a few at the top; the vast majority are doomed from the start to financial losses; and the schemes must use deception to lure consumers into nearly certain financial losses.

Pyramid Scheme Alert has asked the FTC to reopen the case that it previously brought against Amway in which the FTC had charged that Amway operated a pyramid scheme. An Administrative Law Judge in 1979 ruled that Amway could continue to operate in the US, based on Amway's claims that its business was primarily based on retail sales (sales by Amway sales people (IBOS) to actual end-user customers). Amway claimed that the business was not based on each salesperson making money from the investments of other salespersons.


This is excerpts from a page on Pyramid Scheme Alert that discusses a class action suit against Quixtar. http://www.pyramidschemealert.org/PSAMain/news/AmwayPyramidSuit.pdf

Jack and Tim,

Boys this sure sounds a lot like y'all's little scheme. Good thing I have everything and was able to share it. Ho,Ho, Ho!

The anti-Tim

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Postby soapboxmom » Tue Jan 01, 2008 8:20 pm

Jack is back! (on Scam.com)

JackWeinzierl:
Someone forwarded me the recent postings here and to see Mike Bromell, AKA Californian Surfin, commenting here would be humorous, if it were not so sad. Anyone can do a Google search on Mike Bromell from Austin, TX to see his path. Or click on his profile to get a glimpse of his character. He attempts to make a living by calling reps in many companies by swearing and berated them. I appreciate Mike's posts here as it clearly demonstrates what this thread represents. Mike, you really need to spend more time with Heather in Garland, TX.

For those who act as though they care about the truth on this board, do you really think that an MBA that has been president of two traditional companies prior to AC, would still be here after almost 3 years if I didn't believe in what we do 100%? Do you think I would put up with the personal attacks and hatred on this board if I didn't believe 100% in the value proposition we provide? I already know your warped answers.

Happy New Year to you Heather, Michael, Frank Thomas, and Mike Bromell. Frank, I at least applaud you for not hiding behind a screen name even though we do not agree on several key issues of faith and business.

1 John 4:4

You are ready for a career in politics, Jacko. You didn't address one single burning issue that was raised. What a bloomin' goof you are. Cons and frauds operate in the fashion you do. You not so skillfully dance around the subject and never provide any answers or anything of substance at all. I take it your reps are asking many questions such as these:

1. With no retail sales Advantage Conferences is in essence paying de facto commissions for recruiting by the FTC definition. Under Texas Pyramid statutes this makes AC technically an illegal pyramid by definition as well. What makes you think AC is a legal and ethical venture?

2. Why has Tim has repeatedly identified things as trademarked, copyrighted or service marked when they were not so protected and no applications had been made?

3. Why did Tim claim Better Business Bureau membership when he had not been approved?

4. Why has Tim sent out numerous Cease and Desist and threatening letters to numerous ex reps for sharing the truth and their experiences?

5. Why have you, Jack and Tim have claimed only 2 refunds were given, when my research shows at least 6 and many who were denied even though they qualified under the refund policy in effect when they joined?

6. Why has Tim blatantly lied about me. You, Jack, know I never stalked anyone. I never sent any death threats. Do you actually believe those lies won't come back to haunt you boys?

7. Why have you boys claimed Advantage Conferences is growing and exploding when in fact there has been one mass exodus after another?

8. Why did Tim happily sit back while 60 reps got licensed to sell insurance policies on seniors that turned out to be bogus? Tens of thousands in promised commisions were lost when the policies for Hidden Treasures didn't go through.

9. Why did you boys promote The King's Conferences, that were bogus to begin with, as the only speaker other than Tim the pathetic goof was a video of your long gone millionaire speaker. No wonder you can't book that AC promotion fest. Who wants to pay you for an all day Advantage Conferences plugathon?

10. How are you boys going to fund your Super Conference? (Did I hear that dirty word retail again?)

11. What happened to the Brilliant Business Letter, Your Riche Niche, Designed for Success, Givers Magazine, the Footsteps of Faith Conferences, the Millionaire Mindset Conferences, the Brilliant Business Conferences,The Quarterly Teaching series, the Millionaire Mindset Income Producing system, the Self-Qualifying System, the 3 half hour sessions with Tim, Jack and Jim (I jumped ship) Wald?

12. Why has Tim said that there was no winner or that AC prevailed in the court case against the BBB when there is no truth to that? Why has Tim not been honest about the BBB's Motion for Summary Judgment being granted? Why did Tim not do the Christian thing and pay the judgment? Why did Tim not truthfully admit he was forced to satisfy the judgment by a Writ of Garnishment.

13. Why has Tim not fulfilled the subscriptions for Givers magazine or printed the coffee table books he promised?

14. Why did Tim abandon the name Advantage Conferences as a service mark on June 19,2007?

15. Why is Tim claiming I am a disgruntled ex rep for Mary Kay when I was never at any time a rep for Mary Kay? Tim fabricated that whole story and now the Mary Kay legal department is involved. The ladies were none too happy about it.

16. Why is Tim still insisting he has no responsiblitiy for his previous company, All Star Entrepreneur, going bankrupt? He was still a 33% owner, Founder and registered agent when it went under. The majority of the almost 1.3 million in debt was accrued under his watch as President at his home address.

17. Why is Tim telling various conflicting stories about a $400,000.00 embezzlement. His versions of the story cannot be reconciled with any known facts in this case. He never mentioned it in the bankruptcy filing where he does claim he is owed almost $8,000.00. He never sought criminal prosecution, which would mean huge fines and up to ten years in prison for those responsible. Just who was responsible? Was it the 2 ladies or Mr. Green who was President for a whopping 4 months after Tim resigned as President?

18. Jack, why is it you stayed in the background during the frivolous suit filed against the BBB? Did your own attorney tell you to make yourself scarce? What do you think a reputable attorney will tell you to do when the authorities or financially ruined reps take legal action?

19. Why did you boys ask folks to sign up for 100 grand, 250 grand, 500 grand or a cool million in earnings their first year?

20. Why did you boys advertise that folks must be expecting to make $100,000.00 their first year, the goal is to make $100,000.00 with the potential to make much much more, a realistic potential to make 7 figures in 18 months, one could add a zero to their current monthly income and expect to make that, $7000 Over and Over and Over again!, Want to make a million dollars or more as an Advantage Conferences Rep? It is quite possible..., highly successful AC Reps who are making tens of thousands of dollars a month already!.....etc?

You boys know only Jack Weinzierl and Jim Wald exceeded $100,000.00 and 5-7 others have broken even. 98% of the 600 reps have lost money. Many of those reps lost around $20,000.00 or much much more. Why is it you boys don't publish an honest income disclosure statement like many other MLMs do?

21. Jack you can't lump all the scambusters in one group. Why do you continue to do that? I certainly don't lump other AC reps in with you because they are clearly victims. It is Tim and you few at the top that are the ones constantly lying and misleading folks to defraud them out of their money. And, you are right. There will be accountability. I think folks will be facing the music, lad. No doubt that MBA will come in handy, my boy! LOL!

It is time for accountability and responsibility, Jack. We will all be looking forward to your response to these questions!

Soapboxmom

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soapboxmom
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Postby soapboxmom » Thu Jan 10, 2008 11:50 pm

Timmy's delusion:
IV. He gives you the Vision – I will share with you my vision. A big vision requires help. It requires other people, other visionaries, other hands and feet. It requires followers. It requires loyal warriors. It requires ambassadors. It requires voices. It requires dogged determination.

A. Advantage Conferences vision

1. AC has spread the gospel of Jesus Christ to every country of the globe by 2020
2. AC has shared Christian entrepreneurial mindset and wealth mentoring in every country of the globe by 2020
3. AC is a $Billion Company by 2011
4. AC is a global Company (properly licensed) in more than 50 countries by 2015
5. 100,000 people have committed to the Cover to Cover campaign by 2015
6. AC has created 100 millionaires by 2015
7. AC has raised up hundreds of thousands of third world individuals out of their poverty mindset and helped them establish enterprises transcending their poverty
8. AC is one of the most admired companies of all time
9. AC’s products are the model for comparison and measure by consumers everywhere
10. AC’s business methodologies are second to none in ethics, morals, and efficiency


Timmy,

That is not what I am envisioning, lad!

Soapboxmom

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Postby soapboxmom » Tue Jan 15, 2008 4:15 am

http://www.co.collin.tx.us/rsp-bin/PBKR46.PGM

Case History
Case Number: 296-04376-07 Judgements Microfilm
Judge Hon. John Roach, Jr
296th District Court
Plaintiff [REP X]
V.
Defendant ADVANTAGE CONFERENCES,TIMOTHY DARNELL/INDIV, ET EL
Type OTHER CIVIL CASES
Disposition PENDING- NO DISPOSITION

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Transaction Date Time Entry
PLAINTIFF'S ORIGINAL PETITION 12/27/2007 12/27/2007
CIT BY CERT MAIL/JAMES MCHUGH 12/27/2007 12/27/2007
REQ FOR THREE CIT/NO SERVICE 12/27/2007 12/27/2007
ISSD 3 CITS/MLD TO ATTY SASE 12/27/2007 12/27/2007
ISSD CIT BY CERT MAIL 12/27/2007 12/27/2007

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soapboxmom
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Postby soapboxmom » Tue Jan 15, 2008 4:53 pm

Cause No .. 296-04376-07
[REP X], PLAINTIFF,
§ IN THE DISTRICT COURT
JUDICIAL DISTRICT
VS.
ADVANTAGE CONFERENCES, LLC, TIMOTHY S. DARNELL, INDIVIDUALLY,
JACK M. WEINZIERL, INDIVIDUALLY, AND
JAMES MCHUGH, INDIVIDUALLY DEFENDANTS

COLLIN COUNTY, TEXAS

PLAINTIFF'S ORIGINAL PETITION

COMES NOW Plaintiff, [Rep X], complaining of Defendants, Advantage Conferences, LLC, Timothy S. Darnell, Individually, Jack M. Weinzierl, Individually, and James McHugh, Individually, and would show the Court as follows:

DISCOVERY LEVEL
1. DISCOVERY IS INTENDED TO BE CONDUCTED UNDER LEVEL 1 OF RULE 190 OF THE TEXAS RULES OF CIVIL PROCEDURE.

PARTIES
2. Plaintiff, [Rep X], is an individual who resides in Modesto, California.
3. Defendant, Advantage Conferences, LLC, is a Texas limited liability company
and may be served with service of process by serving its registered agent, Timothy
Spencer Darnell at 1513 Home Park Drive, Allen, Texas 75002.

FILED
2001 DEC 27 PH 2: 25
PLAlNTIFF'S ORIGINAL PETITION - Page 1 [Rep X]/Original Petition

4. Defendant, Timothy S. Darnell, is an individual who may be served with service
of process at his residence at 1513 Home Park Drive, Allen, Collin County, Texas 75002.
5. Defendant, Jack M. Weinzierl, is an individual and may be served with service of process at 891 Wagner Way, Lantana, Texas 76226.
6. Defendant, James McHugh, is an individual who may be served with process by certified mail, return receipt requested, at 17215 Bradgate Ave., Cleveland, Ohio 44111.

VENUE
7. Venue of this suit is proper in Collin County, Texas because a substantial part of the acts or omissions giving rise to Plaintiff's causes of action occurred in Collin County, Texas and because at least one of the Defendants resides in Collin
County, and so venue is proper as to all of the Defendants.

CAUSES OF ACTION
FRAUD AND CONSPIRACY
8. Based on information and belief, Plaintiff states that Defendants, acting separately, jointly, and/or in concert made material misrepresentations to Plaintiff in order to induce Plaintiff into investing money in the Advantage Conferences
"Christ-center business opportunity" or alternatively, concealed material facts from Plaintiff that, had those facts been known by Plaintiff, Plaintiff would not have invested such funds into such venture.

PLAINTIFF'S ORIGINAL PETITION - Page 2 [Rep X]/Original Petition

9. Based on information and belief, Defendants knew that these representations were false when made or the representations were asserted without knowledge of the truth of the representations. Defendants also knew the concealed facts were material to the investment being made by Plaintiff
10. Based on information and belief, Defendants intended that Plaintiff rely on the representations.
11. Plaintiff relied on these representations.
12. As a direct and proximate result of the misrepresentations and/or concealment of facts by Defendants, Plaintiff has sustained damages in excess of the minimum
jurisdictional limits of the Court.
13. Defendants' conduct as described above was malicious and the tortuous conduct occurred in whole or in part in Collin County, Texas. Accordingly, Plaintiff requests that exemplary damages be awarded against Defendants.

DECEPTIVE TRADE PRACTICES ACT
14. Defendants' conduct described above also violated the Texas Deceptive Trade Practices Act and, as such, Defendants are liable to Plaintiff pursuant to that
statute.
15. Plaintiff also is entitled to her reasonable attorneys' fees pursuant to the Texas Deceptive Trade Practices Act.

PRAYER

PLAINTIFF'S ORIGINAL PETITION - Page 3 [Rep X]/Original Petition

WHEREFORE, THE ABOVE PREMISES CONSIDERED, Plaintiff [Rep X] respectfully requests that Defendants be cited to appear and answer, and upon final trial, Plaintiff have judgment against the Defendants for the following:
1. Actual damages, treble and exemplary damages against Defendants in an amount in
excess of the minimum jurisdictional limits of the Court;
2. Attorney's fees pursuant to the Texas Deceptive Trade Practices Act;
3. Pre-judgment and post-judgment interest at the maximum legal rate;
4. Cost of courts; and
5. Such other and further relief to which Plaintiff may be justly entitled.

Respectfully submitted,
The Law Office of
FOSTER & FOSTER, P.C.
BY:
Thomas J. Foster State Bar No. 07299000
Susan Johnson Foster State Bar No. 07297700
2701 N. Dallas Parkway, Suite 540 Plano, Texas 75093
(972) 991-1606
(972) 673-0440 Facsimile
ATTORNEYS FOR PLAINTIFF
PLAINTIFF'S ORIGINAL PETITION - Page 4 [Rep X]/Original Petition

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Postby wserra » Tue Jan 15, 2008 6:37 pm

Good for her. This will surely be one to follow. The depositions alone should be a hoot.
"A wise man proportions belief to the evidence."
- David Hume

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Postby soapboxmom » Wed Jan 16, 2008 5:18 pm

http://ecpa.cpa.state.tx.us/coa/servlet/cpa.app.coa.CoaGetTp?Pg=tpid&Search_Nm=advantage%20conferences%20&Button=search&Search_ID=15623777008

Franchise Tax Certification of Account Status

Company Information: ADVANTAGE CONFERENCES LLC
1513 HOME PARK DR
ALLEN, TX 75002-4585

Status: NOT IN GOOD STANDING
Registered Agent: TIMOTHY SPENCER DARNELL
1513 HOME PARK DRIVE
ALLEN, TX 75002
Registered Agent Resignation Date:
State of Incorporation: TX
File Number: 0800218196
Charter/COA Date: June 26, 2003
Charter/COA Type: Charter
Taxpayer Number: 15623777008

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soapboxmom
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Postby soapboxmom » Wed Jan 16, 2008 11:32 pm

Jacko says:
It is unfortunate that [Rep X] has found it in her heart to name me in a lawsuit. I was not her enroller, nor did I talk with her before she joined Advantage Conferences. I even sent her m oney during a difficult time to bless her, while having no obligation to do so. She read and signed the representative agreement and she never attended the company’s main product that she purchased, The Mindset Mentoring Conference. [Rep X] sang the company’s praises on a Mindset Mentoring call that is only for reps, so she was not attempting to influence candidates. I look forward to sharing all of my evidence with a jury. I will spend whatever is necessary to defend my character. I have never been sued and have never sued someone else in 40 years. I have complete confidence that we will prevail.

I also find it disappointing that Soapboxmom, who identified herself as "Elizabeth Templin" to one or more of our speakers (I am not sure why is she trying to misrepresent her identity still since we all know her name and address), who is really Heather Dobrott from Garland, TX, continues down this destructive path. Her latest efforts were to forward a copy of [Rep X]'s suit to our pastor. I will continue to walk in love. We continue to be in prayer for her.

If you feel that you have been influenced in a negative way towards Advantage Conferences or me from defamatory or potentially libelous statements that Heather Dobrott, aka Soapboxmom, Mike Bromell, aka California Surfin, or any other individuals that have posted here on sca m.com, or on Heather Dobrott’s site, please email me your contact information and a summary to:

Jack Weinzierl jack@jackweinzierl.com

Please be as specific as you can. If you were a candidate and this impacted your decision to purchase our mentoring products, please let me know. If you were a representative, and this influenced your mindset, business continuation and earnings, please let me know. If you can estimate the damages that you incurred, that would be helpful too. If you are with another company that gets attacked by these specific individuals on sca m.com, please let me know as well.
:roll:

Soapboxmom

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Postby soapboxmom » Sat Jan 19, 2008 2:43 pm

Shocking, but when Tim claimed I was a disgruntled Mary Kay rep he lied. Here is the letter from the unhappy Mary Kay legal department. I take it they expect him to remove their company name from his replicated websites immediately as they want no association with his scam.

Lisa …… Paralegal
Legal Resources
MARY KAY
January 14,2008
Ms. Heather
Re: Your request for information
Dear Ms. Dobrott:
We are in receipt of your request for verification as to whether or not you may have at any time had a contractual relationship with Mary Kay Inc. Per your request, we made a diligent search of our records with the names and social security number you provided to us, and we have found no one who matches the information provided.
If you have any questions regarding this information, please call me at 972-687-5121.
~relY'
Lisa ……….


http://www.advantageconferences.com/vip/opposition.asp

If we consider the 21 questions above and the phantom suit Timmy fabricated that none of his lawyers or anyone else on the planet can provide a case number for, we have clearly shown that Jack and Tim have some serious explaining to do. If Jack wants to defend his shattered honor he will be forced to blame the whole sordid mess on his brother in Christ, Tim Darnell. All those lies, fabrications, misrepresentations and gross exaggerations will come out in court and can't be explained away. You boys might want to pay the taxes. So, the question may be when will Jack turn on Timmy boy. Nothing is more entertaining than a good old scammer smackdown. Is it every scammer for himself?

Soapboxmom

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Postby soapboxmom » Thu Jan 24, 2008 9:29 pm

Tim and Jack,

FTC says:

Your Responsibilities
If you decide to become a distributor, you are legally responsible for the claims you make about the company, its product and the business opportunities it offers. That applies even if you're repeating claims you read in a company brochure or advertising flyer. The Federal Trade Commission advises you to verify the research behind any claims about a product's performance before repeating those claims to a potential customer.

In addition, if you solicit new distributors, you are responsible for the claims you make about a distributor's earnings potential. Be sure to represent the opportunity honestly and avoid making unrealistic promises. If those promises fall through, remember that you could be held liable.


Soapboxmom

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Postby wserra » Tue Feb 05, 2008 5:37 pm

SBM, you are truly dedicated in your efforts to warn people from this scam. Kudos.

So dedicated, in fact, that the thread's gotten too long. Your two posts from today begin a new thread, and this one is locked.
"A wise man proportions belief to the evidence."
- David Hume


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