Peter of England: He’s still F RE?

[FatGambit]

I don't know the present system for authorising credit/debit card payments, but back 7/8 years ago when I last had a PDQ machine there was an enormous flaw in it which, if you know what you were doing, was well, like printing your own money, I don't want to post details on the forum about it for obvious reason but let's just say once I'd become victim to it and investigated it, I was utterly shocked at how easy it was to do, so if Peter's cards start getting reported as working, then I guess the banks didn't fix it (they were not interested in fixing it back then either).

[TheNewSaint]

if Peter's cards start getting reported as working

I think this would unfold just like the cheques did: the transactions would be initially accepted, and then sent back once the payee fails to see any money transferred to their account.

After a credit card transaction is accepted, it still has to settle, which can take several days. Settling means that money has transferred from the payer's account to the payee's account, to match the card transaction. We all know WeRe Bank is never going to do this. So any credit card charge, even if initially accepted, would fail to settle, and then be returned, much like a bad check. The payee would be notified that the charge was not honored, and the hold against the payer's account would disappear. (Ignoring the fact that WeRe Bank cards aren't tied to any real-world bank account to begin with.)

And I think it is extremely unlikely a WeRe Bank card would even get that far. We know from Peter's dealings with his IT people that he lacks technical skill. The card pictured above has the same non-standard account numbers and sort codes as we've seen before. I can't imagine how a card with that underlying data would produce even a temporary acceptance. I also think Peter knows he has to stay below the radar, and overt credit card fraud would end that quickly.

I think Seelenblut is correct: these cards exist only to promote the scheme. They'll never work, but that's okay, because they distract Peter's customers from the real problems of the scheme. Like this:

[littleFred]

The suckers hope only for a temporary acceptance. If the card bounces a few days or even hours later, it doesn't matter.

When I buy stuff in a shop with a card, they don't know my name and address. The cashier doesn't look at my card. I put the card in the machine, key in the numbers and, when the machine is happy, remove the card. If it bounces next day, the shop doesn't know who I am.

I don't know what it takes to make the machine happy. (And I'm not encouraging discussion of security flaws.) I hope WeRe cards wouldn't make the machine happy.

But I don't think Peter cares about that, any more than he cares about cheques or LLTs being accepted. He cares only about selling them to the suckers, which needs him to pretend they will work.

[FatGambit]

Yeah chargebacks would take anywhere from days to weeks to come through.

[Jeffrey]

I think this would unfold just like the cheques did: the transactions would be initially accepted, and then sent back once the payee fails to see any money transferred to their account.

I don't know where you guys are at but these cards would fail in the states immediately. The card wouldn't be recognized when swiped, cashier says "we only accept Visa, Mastercard, etc" and end of story.

[#six]

My understanding, at least in the uk is that card machines require a network connection to the issuer of the card or to a system that can validate the card. Without that the payment would be refused instantly.

[notorial dissent]

The current generation of machines is a world apart from the old one, particularly in Europe, where they are using the chip security technology. Modern machines, unless you are living out in the back of beyond, and even then anymore I doubt it, are connected via phone line or internet to the computer system holding the interchange information, and you get a real time acceptance or rejection at POS. The only glitch in this is if the card is stolen, and then it can sometimes be weeks or months before it is charged back. There is no way that PoE will be able to get his past since he won't have access to the real chip technology and security, and when the terminal contacts the database it will get an invalid does not exist rejection from the system, which means, NO CAN USE.

[AndyPandy]

My understanding, at least in the uk is that card machines require a network connection to the issuer of the card or to a system that can validate the card. Without that the payment would be refused instantly.

I used to be an auditor for the UK Link Interchange System, if the card entered to atm wasn't on the Link system (Link was owned by the banks in the network) it would spit it back out or keep it.

I'm presuming for the retail system it checks the card first then the balance, zero balance, zero chance of walking out with any 'goodies', isn't that why they introduced the chip n pin because of so many fake cards in operation?

These cards aren't for 'paying off debts' they're an attempt to allow the 'user' to commit theft pure and simple.

[rumpelstilzchen]

I have just been looking at Icke's site and the Resident Retard gremlin has posted links to what he claims is "Quatloos interviewing Peter of England". The links aren't working (surprise surprise) but does anyone on here know anything about Quatloos interviewing PoE? My guess is it's fabricated but who knows?

[grixit]

Of course it's fake! Don't you know we'd never interview him for fear we'd all be exposed as jewish pedophilic masonic government shills.

[Burnaby49]

Of course it's fake! Don't you know we'd never interview him for fear we'd all be exposed as jewish pedophilic masonic government shills.

Speak for yourself. I consider that description of the average Quatloos poster to be deeply offensive. I reject your puerile disparagement but I am proud to accept the title of Alcoholic Jewish Pedophilic Masonic Government Shill. Although I have to confess I'm neither Jewish nor a mason. As far as the alcoholic part goes my British compatriots will find that out when I embarrass myself beyond redemption when I meet them for a "pint". They might have just a pint and be a better person for it but I've never aspired to be a better person. Just ask the long-suffering Mrs. Burnaby49. We're heading towards forty inexplicable years.

[TheNewSaint]

these cards would fail in the states immediately. The card wouldn't be recognized when swiped, cashier says "we only accept Visa, Mastercard, etc" and end of story.

Very true. I was working from FatGambit's hypothetical that Peter somehow tricked the system into accepting these cards.

[notorial dissent]

Which of course would be active fraud.

[daveBeeston]

I hope these cards are real and i look forward to the reports that will follow when people try to use them and are swiftly detained by store security while they wait for the police to arrive which will surely happen.

[rumpelstilzchen]

Of course it's fake! Don't you know we'd never interview him for fear we'd all be exposed as jewish pedophilic masonic government shills.

Yeah, I didn't for one minute think it was a proper interview as such, I thought that maybe someone from here had phoned Peter on his clearance hotline PAYG mobile, recorded it and uploaded it somewhere. I have now listened to it and it turns out it is Bradley Knight posing as a potential customer hoping to clear his sick mother's debts. I don't know if the audio has been posted on here but it is quite interesting. Peter appears to admit the WeRe bank is only for those people who are in a desperate position and have no other choice but to got to WeRe bank to clear their debts. He also seems to say the way it works is that he is facilitating a loan against the customer's promissory note and in ten years time the promissory note must be honoured.

[longdog]

I hope these cards are real and i look forward to the reports that will follow when people try to use them and are swiftly detained by store security while they wait for the police to arrive which will surely happen.

If the mock up in the picture is anything to go by it wouldn't even get that far as the chip isn't the right format so the terminal would just 'ERROR' the thing.

[NYGman]

To be honest, it looked like my laundry card with a sticker with a cutout around the chip to let it show. As noted, none of the text is embossed.

My theory is, when it doesn't work when used, the card holder says, call the bank to manually process it, and if PoE is there, he says, yes all cleared, and the card holder walks away happy.

Of course, this is just a guess and probably only works in person.

[exiledscouser]

Any merchant relying on a call to a cell phone number to validate a purchase probably deserves being ripped off!

Some thoughts; Mr Smith insists WeRe is just for 'public-facing' debt, whatever that means, yet a card like this will be like curry to a piss-head in the hands of yer typical Weary debt-dodger.

Let's go on a repayment free spend-a-thon, new telly, phone and hi-fi!

Only this time passing these off will attract the attention of the 5-oh. But no one ever answers the mobile number so attempts at validation will fall flat, as usual.

But will they get that far? Chip 'n' pin machines and all ATMs will easily detect & reject these Mickey Mouse efforts.

The days of getting away with duff cards are fewer than ever. Cheques are also on the way out - almost archaic in today's world (although I still pay the milk man by cheque) - which reflects Mr Smith's somewhat old fashioned view of banking.

More to the point, actual efforts to use cards of this type will accelerate the disenchantment already setting in with Weary disciples when failure and possibly even arrest results.

For me these cards will follow the mad insurance scheme and worthless bank notes into oblivion. A pity as a few nickings would bring matters quickly to a head.

[FatGambit]

Which of course would be active fraud.

Yup, but this is Peter we're talking about.

I really don't want to go into detail about the (potential) flaws in the credit card system, but they are easily exploited if you know what you're doing (and they may have closed them, you never know), all i am going to say is the first 4-6 digits are the issueing banks identity, the remainder relate to the account, but let's face it anybody buying these cards from Peter isn't going to be interested in the that pesky fraud bit.

[notorial dissent]

I'm more concerned about some merchant getting scammed. I just don't want to see some innocent get hurt, the numbnutz using the card can go to jail as far as I am concerned. I would hope that since the card won't have the network decal on it that it will be an indication it isn't one they can process, but you never know. Them putting a network decal on the card and not belonging will also get them in lots of trouble as well. Card networks prosecute for anything that even looks like fraud.