Losing Your Home, Crawford Style

[AndyPandy]

So how would arson help.

He'd get moved straight to Crown Court in front of a jury because of the seriousness of the offence. It's the obvious way to get a jury trial.

You can burn down your own home as long as you don't endanger anyone or claim on the insurance.

However, if it's proven it's not your home then basically, you're screwed

[noblepa]

So how would arson help.

He'd get moved straight to Crown Court in front of a jury because of the seriousness of the offence. It's the obvious way to get a jury trial.

You can burn down your own home as long as you don't endanger anyone or claim on the insurance.

However, if it's proven it's not your home then basically, you're screwed

Having seen photos of Castle Crawford, and its proximity to the neighboring homes, I don't see any way that that house could be burned safely. Its just too close to the neighbors.

Even if it were proven that he owned the house (which won't happen), he would still be in trouble for endangering the property, and perhaps lives, of others.

Also, in many jurisdictions, particularly in urban areas, a permit from the local fire department is required for a controlled burn. Around here, I think you even have to pay for the fire trucks and firefighters to be on site when you light the fire. Tom would never (in a million years) get such a permit.

[TheNewSaint]

I doubt Tom Crawford has an iota of concern about anyone else who might be harmed in any action he may wish to do. Like most FMOTLs, he's an amoral sociopath who cares only about what he wants.

[Philistine]

I doubt Tom Crawford has an iota of concern about anyone else who might be harmed in any action he may wish to do. Like most FMOTLs, he's an amoral sociopath who cares only about what he wants.

I don't think that is quite proven, and I was going to add before that chances are, if that neighbourhood is anything like most 1st world suburbs, you'd need a permit even to burn rubbish in a burn barrel on the property.

[SteveUK]

Unfortunately for Tom, us Nottingham folk are the subject of a smoke control zone restriction. You can't technically even have a coal or wood fire here. Still, laws are there for the breaking if youre a goodfer I suppose.

[ArthurWankspittle]

Also, in many jurisdictions, particularly in urban areas, a permit from the local fire department is required for a controlled burn. Around here, I think you even have to pay for the fire trucks and firefighters to be on site when you light the fire. Tom would never (in a million years) get such a permit.

No so in England. The worst that would happen is you could be summonsed to (a Magistrates) court for smoke or pollution issues. (For those in the US think like these offences are like misdemeanors). Do some damage or lose control of the fire and you would be charged straight away with arson and have to argue it out in court later.

[exiledscouser]

Burning your house down

To commit an indictable offence

To get yourself to CC and before a jury.

Say, for just one moment you won, not only found not guilty but that the criminal court interfered with the civil (which isn't its function or even within it's ability) and awarded Tom his house back.

He'd go back to a charred mess that he himself chose to burn down.

So the victory (in this completely improbable scenario) would be entirely pyrrhic.

[AndyPandy]

Burning your house down

To commit an indictable offence

To get yourself to CC and before a jury.

Say, for just one moment you won, not only found not guilty but that the criminal court interfered with the civil (which isn't its function or even within it's ability) and awarded Tom his house back.

He'd go back to a charred mess that he himself chose to burn down.

So the victory (in this completely improbable scenario) would be entirely pyrrhic.

Just about sums up your average Sovereign Citizen !!

[TheNewSaint]

I doubt Tom Crawford has an iota of concern about anyone else who might be harmed in any action he may wish to do. Like most FMOTLs, he's an amoral sociopath who cares only about what he wants.

I don't think that is quite proven, and I was going to add before that chances are, if that neighbourhood is anything like most 1st world suburbs, you'd need a permit even to burn rubbish in a burn barrel on the property.

Well, the comment is speculative in nature. But I think it's a safe bet that Tom's not going away quietly. We know that he wants to get the matter before a jury, from his misguided beliefs that this will allow him to re-open the issue of ownership, and that a jury would be more sympathetic than a judge. From what others have said, arson is the only crime serious enough to call for a jury trial. It does tick all the boxes.

[IDIOT]

Unfortunately for Tom, us Nottingham folk are the subject of a smoke control zone restriction. You can't technically even have a coal or wood fire here. Still, laws are there for the breaking if youre a goodfer I suppose.

Don't be a prat and stop posting worthless comments.

Nottingham residents can have coal or wood fires as can anyone else in the UK. Please don't post irrelevant tripe.

[Burnaby49]

Unfortunately for Tom, us Nottingham folk are the subject of a smoke control zone restriction. You can't technically even have a coal or wood fire here. Still, laws are there for the breaking if youre a goodfer I suppose.

Don't be a prat and stop posting worthless comments.

Nottingham residents can have coal or wood fires as can anyone else in the UK. Please don't post irrelevant tripe.

Any more comments like this and I'll start moderating you. I'm not going to tolerate this kind of behavior. Disagreements are accepted but this kind of gratuitous offensiveness over nothing isn't.

[notorial dissent]

It would seem that no one has been able to get it through the old fool's mind that the ONLY thing the next jury he faces is going to be concerned with is whatever crime it was he committed to get there? The won't care about his delusions about Fern Ct and the judge will NEVER let him bring it up. Amanda is too thick to get it too in my estimation

[Footloose52]

Unfortunately for Tom, us Nottingham folk are the subject of a smoke control zone restriction. You can't technically even have a coal or wood fire here. Still, laws are there for the breaking if youre a goodfer I suppose.

That is open to debate as the rules (per Nottingham City website) are:

"If on any day smoke is emitted from a chimney of any building* within a Smoke Control Area, the occupier of that building shall be guilty of an offence". *(This includes garden sheds and greenhouses).

The whole of the Nottingham City area is subject to Smoke Control Orders under the Clean Air Act 1993. There are 27 areas within the City boundary with Orders dating from 1 December 1960 to 1 October 1991.

A list of the most common locally available fuels which may be burned in a Smoke Control Area include:- Coalite, Phurnacite, Homefire, Maxibrite, Roomheat, Newflame, Ancit, Sunbrite, Extracite, Gas, Anthracite and Oil.

The burning of ordinary bituminous coal, wood or garden waste, which are not authorised fuels, will create smoke and, therefore, an offence will be committed. An offence under the Clean Air Act 1993 could lead to prosecution resulting in a fine of up to £1000. Wood is not an authorised fuel, but untreated wood (e.g.logs) can be burnt in appliances that have been approved for burning wood in Smoke Control Areas ('exempt appliances', see below).

Wood that has been treated with preservatives (e.g. fencing, construction timber) is not permitted because combustion produces smoke and toxic gases.

So, on that basis, SteveUK is basically correct that technically a wood or coal fire is illegal, the rider has to be added that certain treated wood and coal fuels are however permitted provided they are burnt in an approved device! Even a bonfire is illegal.

[FatGambit]

Bet it's great around the 5th November, nice clean air lacking that particular charcol scent.

[SteveUK]

Unfortunately for Tom, us Nottingham folk are the subject of a smoke control zone restriction. You can't technically even have a coal or wood fire here. Still, laws are there for the breaking if youre a goodfer I suppose.

Don't be a prat and stop posting worthless comments.

Nottingham residents can have coal or wood fires as can anyone else in the UK. Please don't post irrelevant tripe.

Thank you for your kind comments.
Further details of the order can be found here:


http://www.nottinghamcity.gov.uk/enviro ... and-fuels/

[SteveUK]

Unfortunately for Tom, us Nottingham folk are the subject of a smoke control zone restriction. You can't technically even have a coal or wood fire here. Still, laws are there for the breaking if youre a goodfer I suppose.

That is open to debate as the rules (per Nottingham City website) are:

"If on any day smoke is emitted from a chimney of any building* within a Smoke Control Area, the occupier of that building shall be guilty of an offence". *(This includes garden sheds and greenhouses).

The whole of the Nottingham City area is subject to Smoke Control Orders under the Clean Air Act 1993. There are 27 areas within the City boundary with Orders dating from 1 December 1960 to 1 October 1991.

A list of the most common locally available fuels which may be burned in a Smoke Control Area include:- Coalite, Phurnacite, Homefire, Maxibrite, Roomheat, Newflame, Ancit, Sunbrite, Extracite, Gas, Anthracite and Oil.

The burning of ordinary bituminous coal, wood or garden waste, which are not authorised fuels, will create smoke and, therefore, an offence will be committed. An offence under the Clean Air Act 1993 could lead to prosecution resulting in a fine of up to £1000. Wood is not an authorised fuel, but untreated wood (e.g.logs) can be burnt in appliances that have been approved for burning wood in Smoke Control Areas ('exempt appliances', see below).

Wood that has been treated with preservatives (e.g. fencing, construction timber) is not permitted because combustion produces smoke and toxic gases.

So, on that basis, SteveUK is basically correct that technically a wood or coal fire is illegal, the rider has to be added that certain treated wood and coal fuels are however permitted provided they are burnt in an approved device! Even a bonfire is illegal.

Indeed. We have to buy approved fuels as listed by the council. Many other areas of the U.K. Are also subject to this.

[SteveUK]

Bet it's great around the 5th November, nice clean air lacking that particular charcol scent.

Not that anyone obeys the order ;/)

[getoutofdebtfools]

Back to Amanda Pike's recent Facebook comments about having "loads of up our sleeve" I'd be very surprised if there is any truth in that given that her Onesie sleeve is largely full of 'bingo wings' and chubby forearms.

Really, what could they possibly have that they haven't already spouted about before? Nada, nowt and nothing is my bet.

I fear this fascinating comedy is coming to an end, but i've said that before.....

[noblepa]

I fear this fascinating comedy is coming to an end, but i've said that before.....

I don't know if its coming to an end, but it has ceased being entertaining. Now, it is like watching a car accident. You know that nothing good can possibly come of it, but you can't avert your attention.

[letissier14]

Here we go again ... blah blah blah